Author Topic: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves  (Read 51544 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

ilyala

  • Guest
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #30 on: January 16, 2006, 04:36:37 AM »
well there was a continuous war at henry's court between catholics and protestants... had anne managed to be liked by the king, the catholics would have lost a lot... many had interest to sbotage her

Offline Romanov_fan

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 4611
    • View Profile
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #31 on: March 27, 2006, 08:26:15 AM »
Well, physically, she may not have been his type,  but I doubt she was as ugly as legend. I think she was simply provincial, lacking the knowledge of courtly games and languages and education that Henry expected his wives to have. She may have been intelligent, or even more beautiful than some of his wives, but she didn't have what he looked for in a woman, she wasn't sophisticated. She probably was both in looks and manner not what he expected, and no doubt if the alliance was unprofitable, this didn't help things, although even if she had brought a profitable alliance, one wonders if he would have had her as his wife.

Tsarina_Liz

  • Guest
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #32 on: March 27, 2006, 03:30:06 PM »
Quote
Henry knew about her standard of education in the summer of 1539 - his envoys told him about Anne's personality in their letters - yet he went ahead with the marriage regardless.
She ought to have been better briefed at Rochester and told to flutter her eyes and drop her fan etc. Maybe there was a deliberate lack of communication by someone.  :-/

I agree.  It's also important to remember that the rest of Henry's wives were groomed by handlers (though some more so than others) for their respective futures.  They also invariably grew up in the heady and competitive English court and would have been familiar with the Sun around which English life revolved.  Anna was thrown into her position after living in what I can only compare to a convent.  Even if she was allowed to move in the Clevian Court, which she was not, there was no way it could have prepared her for her position as Queen of England.  And unfortunately the poor girl was never expected to make such an illustrious match and was never prepared.  Even looking back on her situation, her rise to Queen of England is baffling and unexpected.    

Offline Romanov_fan

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 4611
    • View Profile
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #33 on: March 28, 2006, 10:44:03 AM »
It is surprising that she ever became Queen of England, but it is not surprising that she didn't stay very long in that role. Cleves was quiet and provincial especially compared to the court of England in those years. Anne of Cleves was the kind of consort who could have been appreciated later on, when what English kings wanted was quiet, demure German consorts, like her. A time would come when women like Anne of Cleves were the queen consorts of England, but that time was not then.

Tsarina_Liz

  • Guest
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #34 on: March 29, 2006, 01:50:28 PM »
Quote
It is surprising that she ever became Queen of England, but it is not surprising that she didn't stay very long in that role. Cleves was quiet and provincial especially compared to the court of England in those years. Anne of Cleves was the kind of consort who could have been appreciated later on, when what English kings wanted was quiet, demure German consorts, like her. A time would come when women like Anne of Cleves were the queen consorts of England, but that time was not then.

Very true.  It's a shame, though, that she wasn't really given any sort of a chance.

Offline Romanov_fan

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 4611
    • View Profile
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #35 on: March 30, 2006, 10:07:47 AM »
Yes, I think so as well, because I think she had potential, but she wasn't Henry's type of woman.

Offline Kimberly

  • Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 3143
  • Loyaulte me lie
    • View Profile
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #36 on: March 30, 2006, 11:08:07 AM »
I also reckon she would have had fine, healthy children given half a chance.
Member of the Richard III Society

Offline Romanov_fan

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 4611
    • View Profile
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #37 on: March 30, 2006, 12:01:11 PM »
I have always thought that too, as it was early enough in Henry's life, and she was a young, strong German Princess.

bell_the_cat

  • Guest
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #38 on: March 30, 2006, 12:04:36 PM »
Quote
I have always thought that too, as it was early enough in Henry's life, and she was a young, strong German Princess.

She doesn't seem to have been very interested in men really........unlike the fictional Anne in "My Lady of Cleves", who went so far as to sleep with Henry in between wives 5 and 6!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by bell_the_cat »

Offline Kimberly

  • Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 3143
  • Loyaulte me lie
    • View Profile
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #39 on: March 30, 2006, 12:17:45 PM »
Didn't she have a bit of a flirtation going on with Holbein in that book as well?
Member of the Richard III Society

bell_the_cat

  • Guest
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #40 on: March 30, 2006, 12:26:26 PM »
Quote
Didn't she have a bit of a flirtation going on with Holbein in that book as well?

Yes she had him 'n all! Until he died of the plague of course.

All in all the real Anne didn't have a very good score:

1515-1540 no men
Jan-July 1540 married to Henry. Doesn't find him attractive.
1540- 1557 no men.... :(

Offline Romanov_fan

  • Velikye Knyaz
  • ****
  • Posts: 4611
    • View Profile
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #41 on: March 30, 2006, 12:37:36 PM »
Well that is true despite all the therotical discussions about would she have married again, and was converting to Catholism part of that? on the other the thread. Perhaps, she never had much of a chance, being in Cleves, and then being the King of England's cast off. But perhaps also, she was just of those women who are happy being more independent.

Offline Kimberly

  • Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 3143
  • Loyaulte me lie
    • View Profile
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #42 on: March 30, 2006, 12:43:03 PM »
Quote
Quote
Didn't she have a bit of a flirtation going on with Holbein in that book as well?

Yes she had him 'n all! Until he died of the plague of course.

All in all the real Anne didn't have a very good score:

1515-1540 no men
Jan-July 1540 married to Henry. Doesn't find him attractive.
1540- 1557 no men.... :(
Sounds like my score ......until I met the hubby ;D ;D
Member of the Richard III Society

Offline Kimberly

  • Moderator
  • Velikye Knyaz
  • *****
  • Posts: 3143
  • Loyaulte me lie
    • View Profile
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #43 on: March 30, 2006, 12:47:00 PM »
Quote
Well that is true despite all the therotical discussions about would she have married again, and was converting to Catholism part of that? on the other the thread. Perhaps, she never had much of a chance, being in Cleves, and then being the King of England's cast off. But perhaps also, she was just of those women who are happy being more independent.
Yes and it was Henry who gave her the opportunity for independence by giving her Hever, Sudeley and all the rest of the settlement. Anyhoo, she apparently developed a great liking for beer 8-)
Member of the Richard III Society

bell_the_cat

  • Guest
Re: Henry VIII & Anna of Cleves
« Reply #44 on: March 30, 2006, 01:32:31 PM »
Quote
Sounds like my score ......until I met the hubby ;D ;D

Final score:

Kimberly 1 : Anne of Cleves 0
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by bell_the_cat »