Author Topic: MA & LouisXVI's remains  (Read 45638 times)

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Offline Eddie_uk

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #60 on: March 04, 2006, 01:14:23 PM »
I think, rather than moaning, people should just avoid a thread if they don't like the content. Lets discuss what we wish!! (within reason:))
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Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #61 on: March 04, 2006, 01:52:04 PM »
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Yes, sending messages back and forth about Marie Antoinette's head is morbid----"what did it look like", "how long did it lie on the ground", etc.  Well, here are some questions for you:

"Was it full of maggots when it was finally buried?"
"Do you think it smelled of rotting meat?"
"Did anyone cut off an ear for a souvenir?"

Is this a discussion board for historians and scholars or not?  I thought it was, which is why I've been contributing much information that is unknown and many details I've acquired from many years of research and many rare documents.  No more.


I'm very sorry you feel that way - as I am sure are others. You are a valuable contributor to this forum and it would be so much better if you could - as Eddieboy suggests - just avoid threads you don't like, since you're under absolutely no obligation to post on them,
"How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?"
-Sherlock Holmes

"Men forget, but never forgive; women forgive, but never forget."

Offline crotalo

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #62 on: March 05, 2006, 05:07:17 AM »
The end of Marie Antoinette de Lorraine d'Autriche!
What about the end of the thousands petites Maries de Paris, died of smallpox, starvation, exploitation?

  You actually think just like some people who seeing a too fast car said: A cat could be killed!!! Poor cat!! Yhey forget something...

Coq, it's you who decide that the fact of the head between the legs illustrate the end of the life of a queen and not the smell?

Finally. Don't desqualify, please. Are you sure the same adjectifs you employed can not be applied to MA?
You act too mithomaniac. MA never read a single book. David created . She was killed horribly and did'nt deserve that end, but i don't like this epic, tragic, tone. The drawing of David shows the reality. The caricarures are these of Vigée Lebrun. It's fantastic you enjoy with them and dream, but there is an equilibre.

And , yes, beheaded hanging heads are morbid. What else could be more? ??? But those who enjoy whith these morbid tales deserve all the respect and of course are free to express themselves and to have fun.
I have stopped here today, but tomorrow i will pass over
Any prblem ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by crotalo »

Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #63 on: March 05, 2006, 06:35:18 AM »
Good. If you don't like this thread, move on.
"How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?"
-Sherlock Holmes

"Men forget, but never forgive; women forgive, but never forget."

Offline pers

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #64 on: March 05, 2006, 06:43:25 AM »
Let's get a little bit of perspective on this.  In the other threads on the Russian Imperial Family, their remains and what happened to it and the description in FOTR of the murder, are discussed ad nauseam.  So what's the difference?  I am sure that if wax models were made of the remains of the Imperial Family, it would have featured very prominently on this site.  In exactly the same way, the happenings around the remains in the Koptyaki Forest and the subsequent removal is discussed and pulled apart and dissected to the point that just about nothing remains for discussion.

So my point is that there is absolutely nothing wrong with this discussion.  Unlike the others, we have wax deathmasks made of Louis' and MA's heads after their excecution, which to my mind make them very real to us humans, because we can "see" them!  If MA's body was left out to rot for days on end, those who were supposed to take care of it are to blame.  I am actually surprised the french mob did not come and tear it further apart, roasting and eating the liver and heart and taking the head on a tour of the city...

The moderator is right, there is nothing wrong with this discussion.  As a law student, I have attended numerous post mortem examinations as part of forensic law.  I can assure you that there are much worse to be discussed than a severed head!

Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #65 on: March 05, 2006, 06:48:23 AM »
Thank you for that wonderfully concise post pers, with which I completely agree.

Anyone who has a problem with this topic, stay away from it. There's no need to post and tell us of your disapproval.

With that, let us return please to the topic of dicsussion - Marie Antoinette's head.
"How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?"
-Sherlock Holmes

"Men forget, but never forgive; women forgive, but never forget."

Offline coquelicot

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #66 on: March 05, 2006, 07:47:06 AM »
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MA never read a single book. David created


Yes, she read books. Not the serious ones she was supposed to, but she did. And she devoured adventures books while inprisoned in the conciergerie.

She created too. She composed.
qu'ils sachent du moins, que jusqu'à mon dernier moment j'ai pensé à eux.

Offline bell_the_cat

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #67 on: March 06, 2006, 12:28:50 AM »
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Yes, she read books. Not the serious ones she was supposed to, but she did. And she devoured adventures books while inprisoned in the conciergerie.

She created too. She composed.



...and decomposed.  :-/  :D (sorry couldn't resist)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 06:00:00 PM by bell_the_cat »
Never put off until tomorrow what you can put off until the day after tomorrow. (Mark Twain)

Offline coquelicot

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #68 on: March 06, 2006, 12:45:48 AM »
Bell the cat... c'est d'un goût plus que douteux...  ::)
Well... since you said you are sorry, maybe you couldn't help... ok, we won't kill you for that... maybe... ?  ;D
qu'ils sachent du moins, que jusqu'à mon dernier moment j'ai pensé à eux.

Offline crotalo

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #69 on: March 06, 2006, 03:42:34 AM »
OK, OK, Bon appétit !

Offline Sissi

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #70 on: March 06, 2006, 08:33:56 AM »
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My god, you people are morbid.  So much for any interesting, historical, or academic information pertaining to the Bourbon dynasty.  Instead, let's gossip about Marie Antoinette's bloody, severed head!  


   Dear Frohsdorf, I have to admit that I too do not agree with you! The portrait of her head is indeed morbid, but we are not discussing her death in a morbid way! The majority of us if not all of us, are admirers of Marie Antoinette, the way she lived, the way she loved and the way she died! The fact is that many historians rather prefer to focus on the happiest days of her life and not on her death. But her suffering the way she conducted herself and the way she was treated without any regard after her death, makes us love her even more! At least it makes me love her and respect her even more!

   I have not been here for too long but for what I read I don`t think that any of us have morbid thoughts. We are here, discussing what we love... history....
History is beautiful but also sad and cruel.

   All of us including yourself, we are passionates, but for people who do not like history as we do, they might say that it is morbid to talk about dead people all the time!!!  ::)

Offline Sissi

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #71 on: March 06, 2006, 11:34:03 AM »
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...and decomposed.  :-/  :D (sorry couldn't resist)



I read tha t she particularly like reading adventure book, the more disagreable the better, since she said that nothing could afraid her anymore, she had nothing to do all day long, the little maid that attended her said that she use to play with her solitary ring, she would passed it from one finger to another, it must have been terrible for such an energetic woman to find herself locked up in a cell without nothing to do but wait for death!!!  :-[

Offline bell_the_cat

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #72 on: March 06, 2006, 12:39:16 PM »
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 I read tha t she particularly like reading adventure book, the more disagreable the better, since she said that nothing could afraid her anymore, she had nothing to do all day long, the little maid that attended her said that she use to play with her solitary ring, she would passed it from one finger to another, it must have been terrible for such an energetic woman to find herself locked up in a cell without nothing to do but wait for death!!!  :-[


Yes indeed! :(

Didn't she write letters to Fersen while she was in prison using a pinpricks (as she didn't have a pen)? Maybe she used paper from her adventure book?

Never put off until tomorrow what you can put off until the day after tomorrow. (Mark Twain)

Offline Sissi

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #73 on: March 06, 2006, 01:14:11 PM »
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Yes indeed! :(

Didn't she write letters to Fersen while she was in prison using a pinpricks (as she didn't have a pen)? Maybe she used paper from her adventure book?




  I did not know that! But it is perfectly possible since in the Tuillerie she wrote secret message with I believe it was lemon juice, she was quiet an expert in espionage!! ;D


 

Offline coquelicot

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Re: MA & LouisXVI's remains
« Reply #74 on: March 06, 2006, 01:19:05 PM »
I didn't think she wrote to Fersen in the conciergerie. She used a needle to answer the "carnation plot" men.
qu'ils sachent du moins, que jusqu'à mon dernier moment j'ai pensé à eux.