Author Topic: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh  (Read 142010 times)

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Eric_Lowe

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #285 on: August 17, 2012, 05:50:10 PM »
Thanks for the information. I am just saying what people said and the understanding at the time of Edward's marriage to Sophie. If the Queen doesn't have an idea to make Edward Duke of Edinburgh she would not have let the information out without correction from the palace. I call this into mind. Thanks again for the history of the title.

Offline Kalafrana

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #286 on: August 18, 2012, 05:33:46 AM »
'If the Queen doesn't have an idea to make Edward Duke of Edinburgh she would not have let the information out without correction from the palace.'

Not necessarily. The Palace is very much in the habit of remaining silent about things said in the press.

It's certainly possible that the Earl of Wessex will eventually become Duke of Edinburgh, but, as explained above, it will have to wait until after the Queen and the present Duke are dead. The present Prince of Wales, as monarch and after the dukedom has merged with the Crown, can then embark on a fifth creation in favour of his youngest brother.

On the subject of royal dukedoms, what is interesting is that none of them have lasted more than a couple of generations at a time.

To take York as an example, the dukedom was created by Edward III for his fifth son, Edmund of Langley, and passed to Edmund's elder son, Edward, who died at Agincourt (he was found face down in the mud after the battle, having either suffocated or had a heart attack). Edward's younger brother, Richard, Earl of Cambridge, had recently been attainted and executed after allegedly being involved in a plot against Henry V, but the attainder was lifted so that Richard's young son, also Richard, became the next Duke. The younger Richard was killed at the Battle of Wakefield in 1460. He was already under an attainder, so his son, Edward, did not officially inherit, but then seized the throne as Edward IV. Edward IV then granted the dukedom to his younger son, Richard, the younger of the Princes in the Tower, so beginning the tradition that the monarch's second son is made Duke of York. But since then, in every case, the dukedom has either merged with the Crown when the holder has succeeded to the throne (the most recent example is George VI), or died with its holder as he has not had a son. The present Duke continues in this tradition, as he has only daughters.

Kent and Gloucester are doing rather better. Both the present dukes succeeded their fathers. The Duke of Kent has two sons and male-line grandson, and the Duke of Gloucester has a son.

Ann

Eric_Lowe

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #287 on: August 18, 2012, 10:25:07 AM »
As what is being "agreed upon" on Edward's marriage that he will succeed his father as Duke of Edinburgh is nothing but an "understanding". That is really news to me. As since he was not given a dukedom upon get married unlike Andrew who was given York. I think he got a raw deal if his "agree upon" claim is anything but cut and dry. So unlike Beatrice & Eugenie, Edward's daughter will not be a princess of Edinburgh until she becomes a matron. How sad.

darius

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #288 on: August 18, 2012, 01:41:12 PM »
I don´t think Edward´s daughter will ever be officially recognized as a princess of anywhere - mores the shame...

Eric_Lowe

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #289 on: August 18, 2012, 04:53:47 PM »
Well...If his father becomes a Royal Duke, Lady Louise would become HRH Princess Louise of Edinburgh. But I think they changed the rules on that...

Offline Kalafrana

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #290 on: August 19, 2012, 06:39:31 AM »
Under the 1917 Royal Warrant, the two Wessex children are entitled to be Prince James and Princess Louise in any event, as grandchildren of a monarch in the male line. No changes have been made to the Royal Warrant. Their parents have simply decided (presumably with the approval of the Queen) that they should be known by the styles appropriate to children of an Earl.

Who knows, they may decide when they are a bit older that they prefer not to be Prince and Princess anyway. There are precedents. Patricia of Connaught formally renounced her royal titles on her marriage, and Maud of Fife quietly gave up using hers.

Ann 

Eric_Lowe

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #291 on: August 19, 2012, 08:47:42 PM »
True. But they are currently known as Lord James & Lady Louise Mountbatten-Windsor. If his father became a royal duke, they will become Prince & Princess of Edinburgh. That was my naive understanding the issue. So I don't know if the death of their grandfather will effect their status or not. personally I don't think there are enough princesses in the family. With Princess Alexandra of Kent, The Duchess of Kent, The Duchess of Gloucester slowly growing older and take less official duties. The Queen's granddaughters Princesses Eugenie & Beatrice of York should be trained to take over from the older generation.

Anyway return to the Duke, I hope becomes better soon. He looks more and more like his mother, Princess Alice in old age.

Offline Douglas

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #292 on: August 19, 2012, 11:20:36 PM »
I seriously doubt the Duke is being treated for a mere bladder infection.   Males are not usually treated to multiple hospital stays for this malady.  Some day we'll probably know the real story.  He certainly gets around well for someone of his age.  The medical details of the royals is often shrouded in mystery.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2012, 11:23:49 PM by Douglas »

Offline Grace

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #293 on: August 20, 2012, 12:48:39 AM »
I seriously doubt the Duke is being treated for a mere bladder infection.   Males are not usually treated to multiple hospital stays for this malady.  Some day we'll probably know the real story.  He certainly gets around well for someone of his age.  The medical details of the royals is often shrouded in mystery.

In patients of the Duke's advanced age, bladder infections can be serious, particularly recurring ones, so this is not unusual and doesn't necessarily have to signify that they're hiding something from us.

Offline Lucien

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #294 on: August 20, 2012, 01:52:30 AM »
I seriously doubt the Duke is being treated for a mere bladder infection.   Males are not usually treated to multiple hospital stays for this malady.  Some day we'll probably know the real story.  He certainly gets around well for someone of his age.  The medical details of the royals is often shrouded in mystery.

No Douglas,there's not more to it then just this,a bladder infection.But at this age any serious infection can affect the brains fe,
and all the mess that gives.No,precautionary is just that.He can go in- and out of any hospital without showing his gold-card first
like other places on the planet.And trying to get this into the mysterious nonsense is way past it,it's not,it just hurts like hell when
he takes a leak..
« Last Edit: August 20, 2012, 01:54:46 AM by Lucien »
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Offline Kalafrana

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #295 on: August 20, 2012, 03:46:31 AM »
I do hope that it is nothing more than the medical profession and the palce being extra cautious, given the factv that it is jubilee year, the Queen and the Duke are due to celebrate their 65th wedding anniversary in November, and the Duke only has eight months to go to outlive the Duke of Connaught and become the longest lived male member of the royal family.

Eric
Being a royal Duke does not of itself mean that the offspring will be Princes and Princesses. That is restricted to children and male-line grandchildren of a monarch. For example, the Duke of Kent is a Prince as a male-line grandson of George V, but his own children are styled as children of a Duke, so the Earl of St Andrews, Lady Helen Taylor (nee Windsor) and Lord Nicholas Windsor. The Duke of Gloucester and his family are in the same position.

The Earl of Wessex's son is normally referred to as Viscount Severn, not Lord James.

Ann

Offline Lucien

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #296 on: August 20, 2012, 07:30:53 AM »
The Duke was just dismissed from Aberdeen Infermary and looks tip top again!

http://www.royal.gov.uk/

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19317991




« Last Edit: August 20, 2012, 07:39:36 AM by Lucien »
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CHRISinUSA

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #297 on: August 20, 2012, 09:47:49 AM »
I cannot see the possibility for the York princesses to be given full time royal duties.  Right now there are 12 full time royals, and we know the strategy is to reduce that number, not increase it.  Yet William, Kate and Harry are now coming on-board, and assuming Harry marries, there will be 16 soon (not including the York or Wessex children).  

We also know that the palace plans far in advance, so I'm certain they have considered what things might look ten years from now (in 2022).  The Queen and Prince Phillip will either have already passed or very dramatically slowing down, bringing the number to 14.

Given the royal genetics and good health, there is little chance that the Princess Royal (who will then be 72), or Andrew (62) or Edward and Sophie (58 and 57) will be retired by 2022.  So even if all 4 of the Queen's working cousins "retired" (Duke of Kent, Duke & Duchess of Glouchester, and Princess Alexandra), there would still be 10 left.  Toss in the York princesses and we're back up to where we started today (12 working), not to mention the 2 Wessex children approaching adulthood.

To me, the more likely scenario would be that Beatrice and Eugenie, and James and Louise will be urged to lead private careers, perhaps with an occasional royal duty when needed, and the Queen's cousins allowed to slow down or retire one by one over the next decade.   By the time the Queen's children start to exit themselves (maybe 25-30 years from now), there will be a slimmed down but still 7-10 working royals:  King William and Queen Catherine, Harry and his wife, their children (who will then be young adults in their 20s and starting to marry).

Offline mcdnab

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #298 on: August 20, 2012, 02:27:21 PM »
I think there is a clear desire to present the family at the moment as the Queen and her consort and the Wales' (Charles Camilla, William, Catherine and Harry). Partially to emphasise continuity etc and the fact that William and Harry are now undertaking far more duties.
The York girls are undertaking some public appearances with their father (and grandparents) but it has been a limited number and sometimes has simply been the desire of the Duke of York to have one or the other of his daughters with him.
I think it is clear that Edward (partially by not allowing his children to use the HRH they are entitled to) does not wish his children to be so lumbered rather in the way the Princess Royal has chosen to enable her children to lead as relative a private life as they can manage.

Eric_Lowe

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Re: Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh
« Reply #299 on: August 20, 2012, 07:05:54 PM »
Yes. I think the retirement of 4 royal cousins will push the York girls forward as they are the only royal princesses of the generation of William & Harry. They are born royal and not married into the family like Kate & Camilla. So apart from the Princess Royal (Anne) & Princess Alexandra, they are the only "true" princesses and granddaughters of the Queen. Louise was disqualified because that his father did not want her to have a public role with his brother James. But even if they were to do so, they are still too young, while Beatrice & Eugenie are grown women suitable for stepping into the role.