Author Topic: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news  (Read 309772 times)

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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #255 on: November 29, 2006, 01:27:33 PM »
I do not like potential political career of Charles-Napoleon. I do not want, that it did political career. For what political career is necessary Charles-Napoleon? I very much am afraid, that Charles-Napoleon can want to stand in presidents of France per 2007. When elections of the French president take place? What candidates will stand in the French presidents? Through what time term of registration of candidates can end? I do not want and very much I am afraid of restoration of " the third empire "


I have just gotten answer from Charles N. two days ago, he is such a friendly person, but too busy with his political career to answer special questions at the moment. But what to the devil you are "afraid" of? I don´t understand this. Charles Napoleon wants to come into the parliament, that is true, wants to be elected for the parliament in 2007, it´s to read in several newspapers (his circle is in the department Seine- et Marne, party UDF=liberals), but what you are afraid of? What you complain is more than impossible and- to say it directly -does not make any sense.  Firstly there are absolutely other candidates for the president election than "Mr. Bonaparte", one is the a woman (Ségolène Royal,  the first time a woman, as we in Germany have the first time a woman for chancellor ;)), and usually only people are standing for being candidate, who already had great politic positions in the government before. Charles Napoleon was and is a person with -until now- only local political intentions like being deputy major of Ajaccio, so it does not make any sense only to think about him as possible candidate, and furthermore, even if todays Napoleon- which is as I explained MORE THAN IMPOSSIBLE- would be a candidate or a president, what would be sooo terrifying about this? Do you really think Charles Napoleon wants to make career as dictator? I think, on this thread Charles Napoleons political views were already discussed more than thoroughtly and need not to be repeated here again. For this such a comment about a "third Empire" does not have any logical basis and can´t be considered as more than a joke.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2006, 01:35:56 PM by britt.25 »
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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #256 on: November 30, 2006, 06:39:47 AM »
A serious looking man:













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Offline Lucien

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #257 on: December 02, 2006, 11:04:04 AM »
Thanks for the pictures Britt.I wonder were Charles will end up(seats will be shuffled) with the coming election of Madame Royal,oh if pigs could fly...what a pair the two would make.....now that would be a Great Coalition.

Just to enlighten,Madame Royal:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4625248.stm

He stands a very good chance to get elected for parliament.
Je Maintiendrai

Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #258 on: December 03, 2006, 12:45:28 PM »
Yes, that´s an interesting imagination, Royal and modern Napoléon working together-- ::) What a pity that it is only phantasy...but I imagine the modern Bonaparte as a good statesman  ::)

Do you really think that the has good chances to be elected in the parliament. Concerning his local politics on Corsica I have heard that there are or have been a lot of critic voices, especially in conservative rows.


Here some photos of other descendants of Napoleon, not to fix everything only on Charles napoleon. He is my favourite figure from the family and of course he is the most engaged man in politics from the Bonapartes and...he is the head, but lets not forget that there are still others....


The current prince Murat, 8th Prince Murat, born 1944:





holding a photo of his direct ansistor: the famous general & king Joachim Murat.




His son, also called Joachim. he will be the next Prince Murat:






Direct descendants of Emperor Napoleon I:


1) From his son Alexandre Walewski:


a) Count André Walewski:




with a statue of his ansistor Alexandre W.


b) Counts Raphael and Fabrice W.





with pics of their famous ansistor



 




with their families





youngest descendants: children of the Walewskis




Part of count Walewskis flat.


2.) last descendant of Napoleon son count Léon:    

                   (he is now dead)





I hope you enjoyed!


« Last Edit: December 03, 2006, 01:02:59 PM by britt.25 »
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Offline Dmitry Russian

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #259 on: December 04, 2006, 12:55:41 AM »
Excuse me, but all Bonapartes cannot be their imperial highneses. It is not necessary to perceive their titles seriously. All these titles false. Still also I very much did not like that photo with the boy and the girl. There Jean-Christopher and Caroline have been dressed in white shirts, they faced to that picture and smiled. Why they smiled? In fact Napoleon was not their direct ancestor. These the boy and the girl are descendants of the most younger napoleonic brother. But their great-grandfather is the cousin of Napoleon III and the nephew of that Napoleon. That is Jean-Christopher and Caroline are not lineal descendants of two French emperors. What rights to French throne Jean-Christopher and Caroline can have?
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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #260 on: December 04, 2006, 02:51:42 AM »
I thought those questions were already discussed here: Surely, not all descendants of Napoleon bear the title imperial highness. Napoleon´s descendants of his illegitimate issue for example are only counts, as you see it here under the pictures: The counts Walewski and the counts Léon (the last died out in the male line). Even if they are descendants of the emperor, they are not from a legal marriage. It would have been different, if Napoleon had married his love Marie Walewska  ::) or Eleonore Denuelle  ;D
The descendants of Jerome, brother of Napoleon I, have the legal rights to be the pretenders to the french throne. Napoleon I did not leave any (legal) descendants apart from Franz von Reichstadt, who himself died without leaving any successor, and the same with his cousin Napoleon the third, whose only son Eugene died in the Zululand war without having any son or daughter. The descendants of Jerome, it was Prince Jerome Napoleon, the nephew of Napoleon, at that time, were the only descendants from any of Napoleons brothers, so the rights and the title were passed officially to the line of Jerome, because there were no other heirs (apart from Lucien, but he did not have any kingdom)The descendants of Jerome Bonaparte do not only called themselves prentenders to the throne and do not give "themselves" a "wrong title", as you hold the opinion, but they own the title "Prince Napoleon", and they ARE are the OFFICIAL HEIRS of Napoleon. I have not read the laws, where this is written, but it´s official. If one likes or dislike it does not play any role in that case.
I do not understand, why you always worry about that press picture with Prince Jean Christophe and Princess Caroline Napoléon: I suppose that was a special occasion, where they had to pose like this, their opinion about their role as napoleonic successor we can not judge, because those young heirs are personally unknown to us.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2006, 03:02:26 AM by britt.25 »
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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #261 on: December 04, 2006, 01:25:34 PM »
Here I have found two interesting pictures of the three cousins Napoleon:

a) Pierre-Napoléon Bonaparte (son of Lucien) b) Louis Napoléon B. (Emperor Napoleon III) c) And Prince Napoléon (son of Jerome)

The latter became the official heir of the dynasty after Napoleon III did not leave any heir.




Official title: "Les trois cousins"




b.) Prince Napoleon (son of Jerome, later heir of the dynasty), Peter Napoleon B.(Pierre), Prince Murat, above: Napoleon III.


The first one is currently sold at Ebay, unfortunately for a pretty high price...

But maybe interesting for Dmitry, if he still doesn´t know, what dearest Santa shall bring him tomorrow night  ::) 
« Last Edit: December 04, 2006, 01:33:16 PM by britt.25 »
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

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Offline Dmitry Russian

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #262 on: December 04, 2006, 05:05:06 PM »
Well, these the boy and the girl cannot be napoleonic successors because are not lineal descendants of two French emperors. In my opinion, they cannot be the present royal family and to be equal to any European royal family. They cannot be the present aristocrats. Napoleon so loved the brothers and sisters, gave them titles and kingdoms. Naturally, all of them titles and kingdoms were paper. They can be only Mr. and Ms. Bonaparte. Please, it is not necessary to perceive all this seriously. Let's recollect their attitudes with the European royal families.
1) the Younger brother of Napoleon Bonaparte Jerom Bonaparte married on Wurtemberg princess because Napoleon wanted this wedding. But after 1814 the father of this princess has arrested Jerom Bonaparte and held it in the palace because it wanted divorce of Jerom Bonaparte and Wurtemberg princess.
2) the Son of Jerom Bonaparte married on Italian princess because Napoleon III and the Italian king were allies in war against Austria. But the Italian king required support of strong France because Austria did not want association of the Italian grounds in uniform kingdom.
3) Victor Napoleon has grown fond the daughter of the Belgian king, but king Leopold II was categorically against such wedding and has never given the consent to this marriage during the long life. Only in 1909 it has died. Only after death of Leopold II Victor Napoleon and its loved princess have got married.
4) Their son Louis married on Alisa de Foresta. It would be desirable to know, with what princesses Louis could be connected before the wedding with Alisa de Foresta?
5) Charles Napoleon was married on Beatrice de Bourbon of Two Sicilies. But for some reason they have divorced practically at once after a birth of their son. Casual concurrence?
Only descendants of Jerom Bonaparte have related attitudes with royal families. But these related attitudes not so good. Anybody from descendants of other napoleonic brothers has not become related with the European aristocracy. Perhaps, because they are upstarts?
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Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #263 on: December 05, 2006, 10:47:03 AM »
People still refer to them by their royal titles as a matter of courtesy, and are entitled to do so - for example, Princess Caroline of Monaco is often referred to as 'HRH the Princess of Hanover' although Hanover has not existed for more than 150 years.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2006, 11:10:51 AM by Prince_Lieven »
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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #264 on: December 05, 2006, 01:23:58 PM »
Well, these the boy and the girl cannot be napoleonic successors because are not lineal descendants of two French emperors. In my opinion, they cannot be the present royal family and to be equal to any European royal family. They cannot be the present aristocrats. Napoleon so loved the brothers and sisters, gave them titles and kingdoms. Naturally, all of them titles and kingdoms were paper. They can be only Mr. and Ms. Bonaparte. Please, it is not necessary to perceive all this seriously. Let's recollect their attitudes with the European royal families.
1) the Younger brother of Napoleon Bonaparte Jerom Bonaparte married on Wurtemberg princess because Napoleon wanted this wedding. But after 1814 the father of this princess has arrested Jerom Bonaparte and held it in the palace because it wanted divorce of Jerom Bonaparte and Wurtemberg princess.
2) the Son of Jerom Bonaparte married on Italian princess because Napoleon III and the Italian king were allies in war against Austria. But the Italian king required support of strong France because Austria did not want association of the Italian grounds in uniform kingdom.
3) Victor Napoleon has grown fond the daughter of the Belgian king, but king Leopold II was categorically against such wedding and has never given the consent to this marriage during the long life. Only in 1909 it has died. Only after death of Leopold II Victor Napoleon and its loved princess have got married.
4) Their son Louis married on Alisa de Foresta. It would be desirable to know, with what princesses Louis could be connected before the wedding with Alisa de Foresta?
5) Charles Napoleon was married on Beatrice de Bourbon of Two Sicilies. But for some reason they have divorced practically at once after a birth of their son. Casual concurrence?
Only descendants of Jerom Bonaparte have related attitudes with royal families. But these related attitudes not so good. Anybody from descendants of other napoleonic brothers has not become related with the European aristocracy. Perhaps, because they are upstarts?


I am sorry, but this question was already discussed so often. Princess and prince Napoleon are the legal heirs, and -pardon- your personal opinion -or the personal opinion of anyone- does not play any role in that case.
Even if you personally hold the opinion that the young heirs do not have any right on their titles, as Napoleon was a parvenu, one has to accept that the napoleonic empire existed and the rights on the title and the heritage was officially given to the descendants of Jerome Bonaparte. All your statements are partly right, but they do not change anything on Prince and Princess Napoleon´s legal right on their titles.
Your opinion concerning the divorce between Charles and Beatrice cannot be proved by any outstanding person like us, when you say that they divorced because of a possible "concurrence" of their families and their blood- Bonaparte and Bourbon- I hardly believe that these were the main reasons for their divorce, even when I don´t know it for sure, but it may have had completely other reasons. There maybe hundreds of reasons for a divorce.
That only the descendants of Jerome Bonaparte have relations with the European royal families is not completely right. Think for example of the famous Princesse Marie Bonaparte, greatgranddaughter of Lucien B., who was wife to Prince Georg of Greece, whose father was a king.
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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #265 on: December 05, 2006, 01:47:35 PM »
Here are some interesting pictures of the present Princess Napoléon with President Chirac:










« Last Edit: December 05, 2006, 01:54:57 PM by britt.25 »
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Offline Dmitry Russian

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #266 on: December 06, 2006, 05:03:10 PM »
Dear Britta! Why you consider as their princes and their imperial highneses?! I am very tired to repeat, that all this not the present. I am simple in despair.
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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #267 on: December 07, 2006, 02:05:23 AM »
Well, my dear, I have to repeat my myself all the time, as well. I think, this is no real discussion. I do not personally "consider" the present members of the napoleonic family as Princes Napoleón, but they are the heirs. It seems to be a personal problem of you that you cannot accept the truth, but this can´t change the facts.
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Offline Prince_Lieven

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #268 on: December 07, 2006, 06:40:26 AM »
Maybe it would be best for the two of you to just agree to disagree.  ;)
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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #269 on: December 07, 2006, 10:10:52 AM »
How do you mean agree to disagree? :o
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

     Marie Bonaparte (1882-1962)