Author Topic: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news  (Read 309021 times)

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Offline Seth Leonard

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #345 on: April 05, 2007, 10:22:01 AM »
On 19 Mar 2007 H.I.H. the Princess Napoléon attended a Napoleonic event where she laid a wreath at some memorial.

http://vieilleries.over-blog.com/article-6075578.html

Offline Seth Leonard

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #346 on: April 05, 2007, 10:29:16 AM »
Here is an excerpt from a posting on the "Le 13eme Régiment des Dragons Parachutistes Blog" about the Princess's role as that regiment's "marraine" (godmother?):

Quote
Issu du Régiment des Dragons de l'Impératrice, le 13è Régiment de dragons parachutistes a pour marraine depuis 1959, son Altesse Impériale la Princesse Napoléon.
L'émotion de SI. La Princesse Alix Napoléon n'était pas feinte lorsque le général d'armée aérienne Douin, ancien CEMA (ancien chef d'état-major des Armées) l'a faite Chevalier de la Légion d'Honneur dans le cadre d'une brillante réception organisée au Palais de la Légion d'Honneur à Paris.


http://dragonpara.skyblog.com/

Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #347 on: April 05, 2007, 01:34:08 PM »
Hello, and thanks very much for the recent infos and pictures. They are very interesting. It´s wonderful, how the Princess Napoléon still takes part in so many activities. But I wished to see people like her grandson or even her second son Jerome more often. It seems that she often fulfills her tasks alone, but she does it very well. And I must say it again, the look for her age is very good! For me she definetely looks younger than she is.
Concerning the funeral ...I am not sure, if my theory is right (it may be a completely other person), but to me the man with the white hair next to Princess Alix looks la bit ike Prince Antoine de Ligne, who is even a distant cousin of the present Bonapartes through his line from Caroline Bonaparte and Joachim Murat. Antoine died in 2005 , but I looked it up: in summer, and the funeral pictures are from January, so it could be him, but certainly it can be wrong.... ::)

He also looks a bit like this man from another picture from the same site:



If it is him, it cannot be Antoine, because this is not Antoine, but ...





for me it is rather similar to this, and this is Antoine. Could be the same man at the side of the princess?


Here a picture when younger (from the ERHJ):




What do you think? I am not sure, only a possibility.

Thanks again for the picture.  ;)
« Last Edit: April 05, 2007, 01:40:07 PM by britt.25 »
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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #348 on: April 05, 2007, 01:50:19 PM »
Some more direct descendance of Napoleon I. :

Grandson of Napoleon, Alexandre (-Antoine) Walewski (son of Alexander W. and actress Rachel Felix):




Greatgrandson of the emperor, André Walewski:




Two more Walewski descendants: Alexandre, Florian (the last one had died some years ago during a napoleonic festival... :'( )






Greatgrandson of the emperor, count Jacques Matheús : grandson of Napoleons granddaughter Eugenie Walewski (some state she was rather a daughter of Napoleon III than of Walewski, because Anna Maria Ricci, second wife of Napoleon´s son Alexandre, was a mistress of
Nap. III! :P





« Last Edit: April 05, 2007, 01:58:24 PM by britt.25 »
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

     Marie Bonaparte (1882-1962)

Offline Seth Leonard

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #349 on: April 05, 2007, 02:15:55 PM »
Britta,
Firstly, thank you very much for all these pictures of the Walewskis. May I ask how Florian Walewski died?

Secondly, I think you are right that the man next to Princess Alix is the late Antoine de Ligne. However I don't think he is in the #6222 picture. The man next to her more resembles the photo of Antoine from Corbis, I think. Thanks very much for answering that question. Do you have any idea who the two ladies are next to Alix?

I think it is interesting that the Princess Napoléon was given precedence over the Comte and Comtesse de Paris. Although I guess that was because Louis Napoleon was so closely related to Josephine-Charlotte. But if the late Henri d'Orléans (d.1999) had been alive and invited to the funeral, he wouldn't have attended if he knew he'd have to give precedence to a Bonaparte.

Also, according to a guestlist at the Royals Portal Forum (http://www.royals-portal.de/forum/index.php?showtopic=6538), Princess Laure and Prince Jérôme were also supposed to have been there.

Offline Seth Leonard

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #350 on: April 05, 2007, 02:18:51 PM »
Grandson of Napoleon, Alexandre (-Antoine) Walewski (son of Alexander W. and actress Rachel Felix):



Didn't Plon-Plon have an affair with Rachel Felix?

Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #351 on: April 06, 2007, 03:59:52 AM »
Britta,
Firstly, thank you very much for all these pictures of the Walewskis. May I ask how Florian Walewski died?

Secondly, I think you are right that the man next to Princess Alix is the late Antoine de Ligne. However I don't think he is in the #6222 picture. The man next to her more resembles the photo of Antoine from Corbis, I think. Thanks very much for answering that question. Do you have any idea who the two ladies are next to Alix?

I think it is interesting that the Princess Napoléon was given precedence over the Comte and Comtesse de Paris. Although I guess that was because Louis Napoleon was so closely related to Josephine-Charlotte. But if the late Henri d'Orléans (d.1999) had been alive and invited to the funeral, he wouldn't have attended if he knew he'd have to give precedence to a Bonaparte.

Also, according to a guestlist at the Royals Portal Forum (http://www.royals-portal.de/forum/index.php?showtopic=6538), Princess Laure and Prince Jérôme were also supposed to have been there.


Hello, I didn´t ask Nathalie about the death of her father, but on a napoleonic site of 2003 there was a mourning article on him and it was to read that he attended a napoleonic festival and was giving a speech and everything on one of the days, and all seemed Ok with him. On the next say his people were waiting for him and he didn´t appear. So when the hotel stuff was informed and was coming into the room, he was found dead- I had evidently suffered a heart attack or a stroke in the morning and nobody could help him anymore. He was only 68.
It´s strange, because his ancestor Alexandre suffered the same kind of death. I have recently bought a book in Alexander, son of Napoleon, (it´s in french and from 1943 and I have some problems to understand everything), and there is was written, that Alexander W. seemed still very healthy, when he arrived at Straßbourg in 1868. Suddenly he cried for his daughter: "Bring me a glass of water... I need a doctor!" He opened his waistcoat and his tie and break down in a chair. He was dead. The doctors examined him and found out that he had died of a cerebral hemorrage/ apoplexy.
I suppose it might have been similar with Florian. After 2003 his brother Alexandre took over the title of the current count Walewski and now fulfills the tasks....

About the picture of the funeral. No, the man on pic 6222 of course isn´t Antoine. I only said, if the man is the same as on that pic it cannot be him, but I don´t think that they are the same persons. It really could be Antoine. About the ladies I am very unsure. The faces are not to recognize very well, and all of them all dressed in a very similar way. I only have the thought that they might be the sisters- in -law of Prince Antoine. He was married to Alix of Luxemburg, daughter of Charlotte of Lux. and Felix of Bourbon -Parma. Alix also had at least two sisters, and the ladies on the pic do resemble a bit to Antoine´s wife (corbis picture, it´s his wife beside him), but I AM REALLY NOT SURE. They can be totally other people.  :-[

The precendence of the Princess Napoleon, who stands in the near of the Comte of Paris is really interesting. Yes, I also think that the father of the present count of Paris, who died in 1999, wouldn´t have appeared on a festival/ceremony together with a Bonaparte. I remember your interesting text, where we learned that expecially Prince Louis Napoleon and the late Comte Paris never went to the same festival, even when they did not openly offend each other. "Usually when both were invited only one came" said the text. It´s really interesting to see Princess Alix and the Comte of Paris behind her! ;) :o I wonder, how the relation of the Bonapartes and Orléans develops in future... :-X

It´s interesting that Princess Laure and Princess Jerome were present there as well. I wished there was any picture, where they are to see. But on the whole page i didn´t find any. It´s also a bit strange, because I would have expected them in the near of the mother....What a pity! In the first marriage Laure was married to Niccolo di San Germano, who is a relative of the belgian royal family as well.
This might be one more reason for her presence?
« Last Edit: April 06, 2007, 04:09:20 AM by britt.25 »
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

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Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #352 on: April 06, 2007, 04:19:29 AM »
Grandson of Napoleon, Alexandre (-Antoine) Walewski (son of Alexander W. and actress Rachel Felix):



Didn't Plon-Plon have an affair with Rachel Felix?

Really? It would interest me, where you read this. As far as I know Rachel was famous for her affairs with many men, from the poor to the high ranks. But concerning the Bonapartes, she only had an affair with Napoleon´s son Alexander, as far as I know. This affair was quite famous, and their son Alexandre (-Antoine) was born in 1844. When she died early (she had a poor health), Alexander adopted his son by Rachel and let him grow together with his other kids of Anna Maria Ricci. All todays Walewski descendants of Alexandre come from the line of his son by Rachel. I don´t know about any affair with Plon-Plon, or did you confuse anything? ::)
I will look it up again ;)
More of pics of the family I put under the thread about Napoleon and his women, but on the board the quality is rather poor.
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

     Marie Bonaparte (1882-1962)

Offline Seth Leonard

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #353 on: April 06, 2007, 09:55:00 AM »
Didn't Plon-Plon have an affair with Rachel Felix?

Really? It would interest me, where you read this. As far as I know Rachel was famous for her affairs with many men, from the poor to the high ranks. But concerning the Bonapartes, she only had an affair with Napoleon´s son Alexander, as far as I know. This affair was quite famous, and their son Alexandre (-Antoine) was born in 1844. When she died early (she had a poor health), Alexander adopted his son by Rachel and let him grow together with his other kids of Anna Maria Ricci. All todays Walewski descendants of Alexandre come from the line of his son by Rachel. I don´t know about any affair with Plon-Plon, or did you confuse anything? ::)
I will look it up again ;)
More of pics of the family I put under the thread about Napoleon and his women, but on the board the quality is rather poor.
Yes, upon looking again in Plon-Plon: The Life of Prince Napoleon 1822-1891 by Edgar Holt, I found that they did indeed have an affair. Here are some excerpts:
Quote
p.45-46
When Jerome [Plon-Plon's father] went back to Brussels Prince Napoleon stayed in England, partly, no doubt, to have the pleasure of his cousin's company, and partly, one may fairly suspect, because Rachel, the brilliant and beautiful star of the Comedie-Francaise, was making and English tour. Plon-Plon was not yet her lover, but he was already in pursuit of her.
Though Rachel's love-affairs were not exclusively royal, her list of lovers was of the highest distinction. For three years she was the mistress of Count Walewski, the illegitimate son of Napoleon I and the Polish Marie Walewski. She had had an affair with the Prince de Joinville, one of Louis-Philippe's tall and handsome sons. And during her visits to England in 1846 and 1847 she became the mistress of Louis-Napoleon, hwo was clever enough to conduct their liaison without breaking with the rich Miss Howard. Plon-Plon was to be her last prince, and a slow train journey to the north of England in 1847 was the prelude to their long association of later years.
In August of that year Rachel was due to make her first appearances in Lancashire and Scotland. Louis-Napoleon travelled north with her, and rather surprisingly Plon-Plon went with them. In the course of the long journey Louis Napoleon went to sleep; on awakening he saw through half-shut eyes that his cousin and his mistress were locked in each other's arms. With great tact he closed his eyes and went back to sleep, but on the very next day he took the train back to London.
Plon-Plon seems to have realized that he could not detach Rachel from his cousin at this time...
Quote
p.59-60
It was at least a tribute to Plon-Plon's charm, if not to his moral worth, that he was able to acquire delightful mistresses at a time when he was far from wealthy. His reputation for 'debauchery' was gained in his years at the Invalides; a malicious old gossip, Count Viel-Castel, said in his memoirs that Plon-Plon made the Invalides a brothel... He may have done so, but it is quite certain that among his befellows were such talented actresses and singers as Judith, Rosina Stolz and, above all, Elisa-Rachel Felix, who was known to the world as Rachel. His conquest of Rachel was especially notable, for she was avaricious and generally chose lovers who could give her expensive presents.
After its unusual beginning in an English railway carriage Rachel's affair with Plon-Plon was briefly resumed in 1848, and after a temporary breach was firmly re-established in 1849...


Offline Seth Leonard

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #354 on: April 06, 2007, 10:23:53 AM »
It´s interesting that Princess Laure and Princess Jerome were present there as well. I wished there was any picture, where they are to see. But on the whole page i didn´t find any. It´s also a bit strange, because I would have expected them in the near of the mother....What a pity! In the first marriage Laure was married to Niccolo di San Germano, who is a relative of the belgian royal family as well.
This might be one more reason for her presence?

I too was quite disappointed that they didn't have a picture of Laure or Jérôme.

You are thinking of the other sister; it was Catherine who married Nicolò di San Germano. Catherine wasn't on the guestlist. Laure is married to Jean-Claude Lecomte.

Offline Seth Leonard

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #355 on: April 06, 2007, 11:45:11 AM »
I don't know if you have seen this article on Charles already, but I'll go ahead and post it .

Der Letzte Bonaparte (14 Oct 2006)

http://www.charlesnapoleon.com/fichier/SDZ.jpg

Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #356 on: April 06, 2007, 02:55:07 PM »
Thanks very much for the parts of that book. I overestimated my knowledge on Rachel a lot, I really didn´t know that she was the mistress of different Bonapartes! Not at all. I only read about Walwewski. I am very sorry to have told you that it might be a confusion! Indeed you and your book had the better knowledge! But yes, I am here to learn :D ;D  Especially that Louis Napoleon and Plon-Plon shared her as lover...it´s funny that Napoleon III. saw his cousin lying in Rachels arms ;D ;D I didn´t even know that she had affairs with the sons of Louis Philippe as well. So she slept with three Bonaparte cousins as well as with the Orléans family...! What a Lady :o :o The book you mentioned must be very interesting. I must confess that I didn´t read any complete book on Prince Napoléon (Plon-Plon) until now.
There seemed to have been also some kind of competition between the cousins Plon-Plon and Louis Napoléon concerning the relationship of Rachel, even when the book says that Plon-Plon came later than Napoleon III. The affair with Alexandre must have been before that time, because the child of Rachel and Alexandre was born in 1844. The affair with Louis Napoléon began two years later, but yes, that´s good, three cousins at the same time, would have been too much I suppose... :P
The story is very interesting...I have just read an interesting book on Mrs. Howard, mistress of Napoleon III., last year, and it was very interesting as well. It was fascinating how this lady, who already had an illeg son from her early days and had a hard childhood, could come into the highest ranks and was one of Louis Napoleon´s closest people...The gossip of the days told that she had three sons of Louis Napoléon, what in fact wasn´t true, because it only seemed like that: She temporarily cared for Napoleon III´s illegitimate sons count de Labenne, and count d´Orx, but wasn´t their mother of course. Her only son was not the one of Napoleon III. but of another man, who she got to know before her time with Napoleon III. The gossip turned everything. Her way of life and her total abandonment to the emperor ("everything or nothing") was unique and described in a very interesting way the book. Her end of life was rather tragic, when Napoleon III finished the affair, she was very unhappy not only to have lost her lover, but also his children, who were now taken away from her and who she loved very much...The last years she lived in her residence and was never seen outside anymore...

And yes, it was a confusion..it was Catherine, who married Nicolò in her first marriage, and not Laure, who is Jean Claude Lecomte´s wife...My brain was far away this morning...sorry :-[

PS: the article I am reading tomorrow...
« Last Edit: April 06, 2007, 03:01:13 PM by britt.25 »
La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

     Marie Bonaparte (1882-1962)

Offline Seth Leonard

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #357 on: April 29, 2007, 04:31:01 PM »
Interesting news:

Laetitia de Witt has published a biography on her ancestor Prince Victor Napoléon. It is available on Amazon.fr.

Offline britt.25

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #358 on: May 01, 2007, 04:54:39 AM »
Hello!

Thanks for mentioning that the book of Laetitia is now available, but I suppose only in french, will there be any translation later? I don´t know.
Laetitia already gratuated at the Sorbonne with a work on her ansistor Victor some time ago. It´s interesting that her writing is now to buy!


La vérité est plus importante que l'amour

     Marie Bonaparte (1882-1962)

Offline Dmitry Russian

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Re: Imperial France: House Bonaparte news
« Reply #359 on: May 01, 2007, 05:34:54 AM »
Who these the young girl and the young man near to it?
This is Drako Malfoy. This is my most favorite hero.