Author Topic: The Paleys  (Read 308162 times)

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Offline Alexandre64

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #225 on: June 02, 2008, 08:06:40 AM »


Offline Alexandre64

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #227 on: June 05, 2008, 02:42:58 AM »
Prince Vladimir poem written Viatka in 1918, appeared in "Memories of Russia" La Princesse Paley:
French version and English version:
French:
Viatka

"Nuit tranquille,
Mais dont le silence est sinistre,
Le prisonnier ne dort pas.

Les souvenirs d'un passé lointain,
D'un passé chéri,
Envahissent son âme,
Tandis que, sous sa fenêtre, un geôlier veille.
C'est un ennemi féroce, un letton...

Les proches, les aimés sont lugubrement loin,
Tandis que l'ennemi est lugubrement près..."

English:
Viatka

"Night quiet,
But whose silence is sinister,
The prisoner does not sleep.

The memories of a distant past,
From a cherished past,
Envahissent his soul,
While under his window, a jailer day.
It is a fierce enemy, a Latvian ...

The relatives, loved ones are far lugubrement,
While the enemy is near lugubrement ..."

Alex.

Offline Alexandre64

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #228 on: June 16, 2008, 02:59:40 AM »

Offline alexia

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #229 on: June 16, 2008, 03:01:26 PM »
Re the comment on Natalie Paley having a short career in Hollywood. The star of Sylvia Scarlett-Katherine Hepburn and her were watching a public showing of the film, Natalie said to Hepburn "Why aren't they (the audience) laughing" (film supposed to be a comedy) Hepburn to Natalie -"They don't find it funny" The film was a huge flop!

Alexia

Offline RogerV

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #230 on: June 22, 2008, 02:31:22 PM »
Do you think that if Nicholas II had not welcomed them back to Russia and the Paley family remained in exile, that Vladimir, Irina, and Natalie would have been known as Count or Countess Hohenfelsen?


Well, I just happened to come across this entry on www.thepeerage.com:

Vladimir Pavlovich Hohenfelsen, Count Hohenfelsen was born on 9 January 1897 at Paris, France.1 He was also reported to have been born on 9 January 1897 at St. Petersburg, Russia. He was the son of Pavel Aleksandrovich Romanov, Grand Duke of Russia and Olga Valerianovna Karnovich. He died on 17 July 1918 at age 21 executed by the Bolsheviks by being thrown down a mineshaft.1
Vladimir Pavlovich Hohenfelsen, Count Hohenfelsen gained the title of Count Hohenfelsen.1 He was created Prince Vladimir Paley in 1904.


So there's at least ONE site which maintains that Vladimir/Volodia held the title of Count Hohenfelsen.  The same page lists his sisters without the surname Hohenfelsen.  Is it possible that Grand Duke Pavel/Paul requested a title for his wife, as well as his son?  It actually makes sense, as Volodia's contemporaries would most likely have held titles of nobility or royalty of some kind.  His sisters would have had the chance to gain titles by marriage, but it doesn't work that way for men. 

The reference to Volodia becoming Prince Vladimir Paley in 1904 has to wrong.  Possibly a typograpical error, and should read 1914?   EDIT:  I just realized it should probably read "after 1904."

This is a link to the entire page:   http://www.thepeerage.com/p10200.htm#i101999   Scroll down about halfway to find the entry.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2008, 02:48:01 PM by RogerV »

Offline LisaDavidson

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #231 on: June 25, 2008, 01:04:11 AM »
Do you think that if Nicholas II had not welcomed them back to Russia and the Paley family remained in exile, that Vladimir, Irina, and Natalie would have been known as Count or Countess Hohenfelsen?


Well, I just happened to come across this entry on www.thepeerage.com:

Vladimir Pavlovich Hohenfelsen, Count Hohenfelsen was born on 9 January 1897 at Paris, France.1 He was also reported to have been born on 9 January 1897 at St. Petersburg, Russia. He was the son of Pavel Aleksandrovich Romanov, Grand Duke of Russia and Olga Valerianovna Karnovich. He died on 17 July 1918 at age 21 executed by the Bolsheviks by being thrown down a mineshaft.1
Vladimir Pavlovich Hohenfelsen, Count Hohenfelsen gained the title of Count Hohenfelsen.1 He was created Prince Vladimir Paley in 1904.


So there's at least ONE site which maintains that Vladimir/Volodia held the title of Count Hohenfelsen.  The same page lists his sisters without the surname Hohenfelsen.  Is it possible that Grand Duke Pavel/Paul requested a title for his wife, as well as his son?  It actually makes sense, as Volodia's contemporaries would most likely have held titles of nobility or royalty of some kind.  His sisters would have had the chance to gain titles by marriage, but it doesn't work that way for men. 

The reference to Volodia becoming Prince Vladimir Paley in 1904 has to wrong.  Possibly a typograpical error, and should read 1914?   EDIT:  I just realized it should probably read "after 1904."

This is a link to the entire page:   http://www.thepeerage.com/p10200.htm#i101999   Scroll down about halfway to find the entry.

Olga Valerianova was created Princess Paley in 1915 after her return to Russia with her husband and children in WWI. She was warmly welcomed by the Emperor and his family. As a result of being fully accepted back into the dynasty and receipt of the title, their son Vladimir was known thereafter as Prince Vladimir Paley, and their daughters as Princess Irene (or Natalie) Paley.

Prior to their return to Russia, Olga V used the style Countess Hohenfelsen from 1904, which had been granted to her by the Regent of Bavaria. Her children were known as Count/(ess) (First Name) Hohenfelsen. This style  was in use from 1904 until they were designated Paleys. However, Hohenfelsen was not a surname, it was part of their style. And, a style is not the same thing as a title. After they were designated Paleys, they no longer used the Hohenfelsen style.

From the time of her marriage to Grand Duke Paul in 1902 until 1904, Olga V and Vladimir were in a kind of legal name limbo. Olga V married a man without a surname, and so she likely had to use the name from her first marriage, Olga von Piskeltors, and their son was probably still known by his birth name, Vladimir Ericovich von Piskeltors.

For someone who was only alive 21 years, Prince Paley had an amazing number of names. He began his life as legally the son of his mother's first husband, even though his actual father was known to be Grand Duke Paul.

Offline Alexandre64

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #232 on: June 28, 2008, 02:53:11 AM »
Portrait of Princess Paley:

Offline Alexandre64

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #233 on: July 06, 2008, 04:19:07 AM »

Poem, in french, appeared on the book by Jorge Saenz and will link:
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Pavlovitch_Paley

"A mes petites soeurs

Pendant des mois, des ans et des siècles entiers,

Tandis qu’au fond du ciel, Anges, vous sanglotiez,

La femme a pu se plaindre et l’homme a pu maudire –

Mais les petits enfants n’ont cessé de sourire!"



Offline Alexandre64

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #234 on: July 08, 2008, 03:45:45 AM »
Nathalie:


Offline Alexandre64

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #235 on: July 12, 2008, 08:24:21 AM »
Paul Alexandrovitch:


Olga Paley, in 1914:

Offline Mandie, the Gothic Empress

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #236 on: July 12, 2008, 10:25:09 AM »
Nice!  :D

Offline Paul

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #237 on: July 13, 2008, 11:01:02 AM »
Natalia Paley was, indeed, stunning!

Mixing Romanov w/ commoner blood seemed to produce some remarkable looking women, if Princess Paley, Countess de Torby, and Princess Iskander are any indication.
The only real possession you'll ever have is your character.
Tom Wolfe
US author & journalist (1931 - )

Offline Alexandre64

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #238 on: July 16, 2008, 03:15:43 AM »
Poem of Prince Paley,French version (translated by me) and Spanish version (translated by Jorge Saenz):

Soeurs de Charité

Soeurs de Charité, les anges sur terre,
bon et gentils, un peu triste,
Vous versé vos  baume sur les cœurs des patients,
vous, amis lumineux, cadeau de Dieu.

Pour vous - bénédictions, les sœurs de l'âme fatiguée,
fleur rose, sur le champ de bataille,
et le rayonnement des croix, la luminosité - rubis brillant,
Les prières tranquille prisent sur  les blessures ...

Crimée. Juin 1915.


------
HERMANAS DE LA CARIDAD

Hermanas de la caridad, ángeles terrenos,
buenas y gentiles, un poco tristes,
vosotras, bálsamo derramado sobre los corazones pacientes,
vosotras, amigas luminosas, regalo de Dios.

A vosotras – bendiciones, hermanas de las almas cansadas,
rosas florecidas, allí, en el campo de batalla,
y en la radiantez de las cruces, el brillo – brillo rubí,
las plegarias tranquilamente tomadas de las heridas...

Crimea. Junio de 1915.

Offline Alexandre64

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Re: The Paleys
« Reply #239 on: July 28, 2008, 08:12:09 AM »
Princess Paley, in 1923:


Prince Vladimir, 19 years: