King Edward VIII and Wallis Simpson (Duke and Duchess of Windsor)

[Kalafrana]

I am cautious about the pro-Nazi tales and suggestions that the Duchess was passing information to Ribbontrop. However, their activities from 1937-40 show a clear lack of judgement at best, and raise the possibility that the Nazi leadership could have made use of them for their own purposes - or at any raise tried to.

Is anything much known about this 'Father Odo'?

Ann

[Constantinople]

Here is something on him before he assumed that disguise
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albrecht,_Duke_of_W%C3%BCrttemberg
that may be Father Odo's fathers bio
I have read a few things that say Father Odo was sent by the Nazis and some that say he was exiled by the Nazis.

[LadyCathy]

All I know is that David and Wallis were consorting with the Mosley fascists for years.  British Intelligence had plenty of people who were monitoring who went in and out of the Germany Embassy.  Dudley Forwood, King Edward VIII's equerry, stated unequivocally that after a meeting David would tell Wallis what had gone on and Wallis would go to the German Embassy and tell Ribbentrop.  What business did Wallis Simpson have with the Germany Embassy?  I do not believe for one minute that David Windsor would have sided with Hitler if his country was being bombed.  I do believe that his dearest wish was for his wife to be Queen of England and he would have gone along with just about anything to have that happen.  This includes deposing his brother, King George VI and Queen Elizabeth and his two nieces, Elizabeth and Margaret.  I believe that the Queen Mother kinew this, although it must have been very hard for Bertie to accept.  I hope I am not offending anyone, but he was really an exceptionally stupid, uneducated, spoiled man, who was totally obsessed with his wife and what he could give her so she would keep loving him.

[Douglas]

I looked  recently through Wilson's book,  "Dancing With the Devil" for the secret of their marriage .

As for Wilson's other blockbuster revelation -- that the duchess was genetically male -- that's also a secondhand thought, taken from Bloch, who heard it from a long-dead gynecologist in London, who heard it from a physician who had treated the duchess.

 According to this theory, Wallis Simpson had androgen insensitivity syndrome, a hormonal irregularity that causes a genetically male body to develop as a woman, although without fully developed sex organs. "When they reach maturity such women exude certain male characteristics and can have unusually strident personalities," Wilson tells us. "Such people cannot bear children and unless aided by surgery, often cannot experience sexual intercourse."

 There has also been plenty of rumors that the Duke and Duchess  never had sex in the normal sense. Their romantic life was of the type that is called 'oral'.  "No man is allowed to touch me below the Mason-Dixon Line," the duchess once said.

We must remember that Wallis had no children as a result of her three marriages.  As a romantic couple, I always admired them.  They made the best of an unusual life.  Vapid, narcissistic, pointless, of course...but what would you expect from such a union.  

The Duke as an intellectual?  Not really, his father and mother discouraged him from intellectual pursuits.   His pursuits centered on the territory below the Mason-Dixon line.

[Constantinople]

I heard that she was a hermaphrodite, which is probably another way of saying what you did.  It is very sad to think that Edward gave up his royal responsibilities for good sex.

[Greg_King]

And people wonder why Wallis has a bad reputation? She's been vilified more often and frequently than just about any other royal figure I can think of.

So let's put this nonsense straight to bed: In 1998 I interviewed Dr. Jean Thin, the personal physician to the Duke and Duchess in Paris, for my biography of Wallis, and asked him directly about what Bloch had said regarding Wallis's sexuality. Thin said that it was nonsense-he'd personally done cervical examinations of the Duchess-and specifically asked that I QUOTE HIM that she had :normal female sexual organs" on this as dispelling it. Later I contacted Bloch who admitted that it was all rumor. Just stop for a second and consider everything that's been said-she was a prostitute, she was a hermaphrodite, she was a man, she had (according to British Intelligence) "genitalia knotted like grapes" that prevented intercourse (and this from "people who had "seen" her in childhood, no less). Consistency demands that at least some of these cannot be true if others are-and there is absolutely NO evidence for any of this nonsense about her being a man, having deformed genitalia, etc. She DID have a hysterectomy in 1933 or 1934 that Barbara Cartland told me about-and Wallis had told her about it; Aline, Countess of Romanones, also confirmed this to me. I feel really confident in stating that there is absolutely no truth to these tales

[aleksandr pavlovich]

 Re Reply #959 and Douglas:  Was there not a quote that made the rounds, attributed to Wallis stating that as for having progeny, the Duke  "was not "Heir-conditioned?'"  Seems to have been enough mis-connects to spread blame around!  (Perhaps it has been mentioned before on one of these threads.)  Additionally, some other rude/crude (and unprintable) remarks about his comparative "development" are allegedly from fellow military officers  housed in somewhat close quarters with the (at that time) young Prince, or either from changing room members of sports teams in which he participated. (And, yes, I know the typical "rejoinder" retort that is usually proffered in reply, but I'm not certain that HE had that "ready response"!)   Regards,  AP.

[Douglas]

Re Reply #959 and Douglas:  Was there not a quote that made the rounds, attributed to Wallis stating that as for having progeny, the Duke  "was not "Heir-conditioned?'"  Seems to have been enough mis-connects to spread blame around!  (Perhaps it has been mentioned before on one of these threads.)  Additionally, some other rude/crude remarks about his comparative "development" are allegedly from fellow naval officers  housed in somewhat close quaters with the (at that time) young Prince.    Regards,  AP.

I just don't know for sure anything about this royal pair, Alexsandr.  You read and hear all kinds of rumors about their private life.  I agree with Greg that Wallis was certainly female.  But beyond that,  all we have is speculation and gossip.  Everyone who has studied this pair have heard the rumors about Wallis favorite sex act, that it was this act that cemented the Duke to her for life and was the occasion of many of his jewelry gifts to her.  Wouldn't surprise me at all, if it were fact but who really knows.  Stranger things have happened.

 Complex and lovely a pair as they were, I wouldn't doubt that some rumors were true.  Plus, we can't forget the famous Duke, Duchess and Donahue aventure.  What was that really all about?  Knowing men and women as I do, I can imagine many things in the mix.

Confidently yours,.

 DH

PS:  Greg writes: "So let's put this nonsense straight to bed"......did you really mean to say that..??

[LadyCathy]

This is what I believe.  Wallis was a woman.  She had a hysterectomy and therefore had female "parts."  She did sleep around and may have developed cervical cancer which necessitated a hysterectomy.  The Duke of Windsor was probably sterile having had the mumps as a school boy.  If a baby had happened I think the Duke would have been head over heels with the baby as he, along with all of King George V's children were great parents and very sweet with kids.  Just my own thought here is that I am glad they had no children as who knows what kind of problems would have cropped up about hereditary kingship etc.  I am glad they showered all their parental love on their terrible dogs who were spoilt beyond belief, and I tend to think that Wallis would not have made a good mother, but that is just me and I may be wrong.

[grandduchessella]

I have tossed out the lunatic pressing claims to be the illegitimate bastard child of the Duke of Windsor and a paid prostitute.  We brook no tolerance for unsubstantiated claims, more so today when a cheap DNA test can conclusively prove or disprove the claim.

I admit I was at first willing to allow her to post, without any reference to her claims of paternity until I saw her own website.  That made my decision easy. This is a place of genuine historical discussion, backed up with facts, not wild assertions.

Thanks to the person who gave me the heads up about this.   This lunatic is banned, like all the rest.

carry on

FA

Yes, this person made the following claims as well which I found on an *ahem* 'newsgroup':

"Queen Elizabeth is Hitler’s Niece says King Edward’s daughter

Queen Elizabeth’s father, King George VI, was also Adolph Hitler’s half-brother (not father as initially reported) according to Emily Elizabeth Catherine Josephine Mary Windsor-Cragg, [illegitimate] daughter of Edward VIII Duke of Windsor.

“Hitler was born in 1889 five years before Edward VIII, when "Georgie" (Victoria's favorite) was 23, long before his marriage to May Teck. He was brought up and abused as the eldest son in Bavaria, and Kaiser Wilhelm, the idealist, was in touch with him. The Duke of Windsor met his older half-brother for the first time in Germany in 1937; however, I have a document that shows Hitler was an intel agent for the British in the 1920's, so he probably KNEW Wallis,” she says.

“Edward VIII Duke of Windsor was routed out, scapegoated, bankrupted, exiled and labeled as Not-See because his wife, unbeknownst to him on his wedding day, was an MI-5 agent of his Father, the King George V,” she says.

“Edward VIII [my dad] was never allowed to marry anybody he liked; only ditsie royal women were permitted to him. So, of course, a black intel ops woman was very attractive, if only because he was so isolated from marriageable women,” she continues.

“The whole story is held at Windsor Library in the Royal diary archives near where my father made his home before he was kicked out of England,” she adds.

Kaiser Wilhelm was exiled and Czar Nicholas was slaughtered by the Cocaine addicted bully George V because they knew the secret about Hitler’s parentage, says Lady Windsor-Cragg.

This information about Hitler contradicts the results of an Austrian Parliamentary investigation and other testimony by close Hitler aides that his father was the Baron Rothschild. Hopefully authorities in the UK will act promptly to check the Royal diary archives to confirm Lady Widnsor-Cragg’s assertions before the evidence is hidden."


Ah--so now we know the REAL story (about so many things) ! 

[Constantinople]

Well it is certaing nice to go to bed one night thinking you know the truth and then to be smacked in the face with the truth and have that  revellation turn your world upside down.  Does anyone have Ms Craig-Windsor's contact details, we have her room ready at Chateau Sans Mentis, an elegant little spa.

[Kalafrana]

This is the most far-fetched tale I've seen this year!

Ann

[Lindelle]

Maybe they just chose not to have children.

[Kalafrana]

If the Duchess had a hysterectomy in 1933-34 then she could not have had children by the Duke - whether he was sterile or not. That she had no children by her first two husbands suggests that either she was barren in any case, or, alternatively, that she wasn't particularly fertile and the limited contraceptive methods available at that time worked for her.

As to the Hitler tale, for there to be any truth in it, one or other of Hitler's utterly obscure parents would have had to have had a fling with one or other of George VI's (presumably the drunken bully Alois Schicklgruber with the refined Queen Mary). How unlikely can you get?

Ann

[Constantinople]

Dear Kalafrana
               Nice of you to give the Hitler story some credence.  I have some waterfrong property for you at knockdown prices.  Viewing is limited to low tide but can arrange  quick transfer for £15 million.  The Kazakhstan deal fell though.