Author Topic: Did Sophie Buxhoeveden Betray the IF?  (Read 46837 times)

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Annie

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Did Sophie Buxhoeveden Betray the IF?
« on: July 25, 2007, 04:00:16 PM »
For those of you who have seen or read it, I need to know something. A person has told me that in her diary, Alexandra spoke of Sophie Buxhoevedon betraying the family. (this is of course yet another tale AA supporters use to prove she 'knew' something) I don't believe the 'betrayal' story and never did. SB ended up working for Alix's sister in her last days, and if you read her own books, she explained everything and I'm satisified with her story.If anyone has any earthshaking info on this, I'd like to hear it. Did Alix write anything in her diary about this? (I am very skeptical but asking just to be sure)
« Last Edit: August 10, 2007, 01:27:04 PM by Forum Admin »

helenazar

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2007, 05:36:53 PM »
I have AF's diary and can double check this, but I don't remember seeing anything like this off hand. Who was the person who quoted this and can he/she let us know the dates in the diary where this was mentioned?

Offline amelia

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2007, 06:24:21 PM »
Is it possible to buy her diary in English? What is the title and where can I buy it?  Thank you.

Amelia

Annie

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2007, 06:38:40 PM »
Is it possible to buy her diary in English? What is the title and where can I buy it?  Thank you.

Amelia

Her diary was always in English, that's the language she wrote it in.

I don't know where to buy it, where did you get yours, Helen? Can you get one online?
« Last Edit: July 25, 2007, 06:41:37 PM by Annie »

Annie

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2007, 06:41:03 PM »
I have AF's diary and can double check this, but I don't remember seeing anything like this off hand.


Who was the person who quoted this and can he/she let us know the dates in the diary where this was mentioned?

As usual, no, the person just says it's a fact but there's nothing to back it up with. That's why I'm trying to find a real diary to prove it wrong. Thanks for anything you can find.

helenazar

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2007, 07:23:29 PM »

ImperialHighness

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2007, 05:28:22 AM »
Sophie was accused of betraying the family by taking money from them and later informing their guards that the Romanov children had sewed jewels into their clothing.(King, Greg, and Wilson, Penny, The Fate of the Romanovs)
Buxhoeveden borrowed 1,300 rubles from the Romanov childrens' tutor Charles Sydney Gibbes to escape Russia. Though she told him she'd return the money, she never did. "I knew she was greedy, but I never knew she'd go that far!" Gibbes wrote to the French tutor Pierre Gilliard.(King and Wilson, p. 505)
She was not trusted by the Tsar's sister, Grand Duchess Xenia Alexandrovna of Russia, who warned Victoria that "Isa" (Sophies nickname) was not to be trusted later, when Sophie lived at Hemmelmark for some time.
Sophie was the one to identify Franziska Schanzkovsky, the so called Anastasia during the first time Franziska stayed at Dallheim. It was when Franziska said she was Tatiana. Sophie did not recognize any similarity.
I think maybe she took the money from the family, who knows? She later made good profit with her books about them, too. Do you think Alix would have liked to read those books about her and her family life? I do not think so.
We say in German:"To bite the hand which feeds you."

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Offline Eddie_uk

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2007, 05:32:01 AM »
Interesting. As a side note though I would be cautious in quoting from The Fate of The Romanovs. I think there was a discussion about it sometime ago which revealed some less than accurate sources. Maybe someone else has some more information. :)
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dmitri

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #8 on: August 05, 2007, 05:39:54 AM »
Yes I had heard the same. As for the Baroness I do not know what to believe. I do think anybody who did not support Anna Anderson was deliberately targeted for abuse by her supporters. As for Alexandra Feodorovna, I think she would have understood people would have written about her after her death even if she had still being a reigning Empress Consort when she died. That has happened for a very long time indeed and not always flattering. Mabel, Countess of Airlie after all wrote a biography after the death of Queen Mary. Does anybody tarnish her name because of it? Different opinions from primary sources always are treasured by historians. Being there is far better than second hand information. Of course facts and interpretations occur. It is up to the reader to examine the ultimate truth.

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2007, 08:20:39 AM »
For those of you who have seen or read it, I need to know something. A person has told me that in her diary, Alexandra spoke of Sophie Buxhoevedon betraying the family.

I've read Alexandra's diary, and I certainly don't recall anything like that. I will double-check as well.

Offline Sarushka

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2007, 09:37:53 AM »
I've just paged through the entire Yekaterinburg section of Alexandra's diary, and I spotted NO mention -- good, bad or indifferent -- of Buxhoeveden.

ImperialHighness

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #11 on: August 06, 2007, 10:18:28 AM »
I have the diary and letters of Alix from 1914 to 1918 to Nicky in German, a book published in the 1920s and I have read it twice- I could not find anything about Buxhoeveden, Alix is most of the time worried about Nicky, Alexei, Ania and so on.
Maybe someone just tried to blame her for nothing.
But maybe she just got egoistic and took the money. In those days it was pretty hard and she escaped Russia. The immigrants from Russia lost most of their wealth and were in need of money.



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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #12 on: August 06, 2007, 10:22:22 AM »
I think this may be a confusion with something that Gibbes wrote. HE was angry at Bux for allegedly taking money from him and not repaying it. Can't recall the details off hand, I think it was a joint account they had together in Tobolsk and she withdrew all the money, including his...

ImperialHighness

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #13 on: August 06, 2007, 11:06:48 AM »
I just found this from Xenia:
A statement was made in March 1958 by Grand Duchess Xenia that she believed in her (Isa).

Baroness Sophie Buxhoeveden died on 26 November 1956. She left a number of items that had belonged to the Russian imperial family to Grand Duchess Xenia including, "a green enamel Faberge pencil given to her by Empress Alexandra ... a white china cup with a pattern of cornflowers and the mark NII used by the Emperor at Tobolsk .. a small wooden Ikon .. with a few words of prayer written by the Empress at Tobolsk ... ". Xenia was confused about this things, but Sophie has always told everyone that Alix was her friend and maybe Gilliard was just angry on her (Isa) and tried to blame her. It s easy to start a rumour.

helenazar

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Re: Her diary- a question
« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2007, 01:49:11 PM »
This is why it's always a good idea to check sources in books if possible, and not just take information for granted... Sometimes this information could be based on unsubstantiated rumors, or simply just blown out of proportion to make things sound "juicier" than they were in reality, which seems to be the case with Bux.